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 [convention/event] Crucible, Invitation to Crucible: A Magic(k) Convention, Oct. 6 in Edison, NJ
LordArthur
post Sep 7 2007, 08:55 AM
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Hello everyone! I just would like to extend an invite to all of you to a convention my group is organizing on October 6 in Edison, NJ called Crucible. Crucible is a magic(k) convention open to members of all walks of magic. During the event, we will have a number of speakers from a variety of traditions. It's a great way to meet others who are into magic(k) and to get an idea of the vast amount of traditions/paths out there. Some of the speakers we have and topics include:
  • Rouhaniat, also known as Al Hikmah by Jow. Rouhaniat is a form of contemporary, medieval-based Arabian Magick. The lecture will cover magical theory, history, and practical applications.
  • Magickal Combat by Inominandum (Jason Miller). In this class Jason Miller, the author of Protection and Reversal Magick, will lay out strategies and methods used in magickal conflicts, either between sorcerer and spirit, or magician vs magician. Methods of protection, obfuscation, binding, expelling, jinxing and cursing will all be discussed. Material will range from High Ceremonial magick to Hedge Magick and everything in between.
  • Beliefs and Practices of Haitian Vodou by Houngan Hector, Haitian Vodou High Priest. The overview will include God, Spirits (Lwa), Magic, Initiation, and a variety of other topics. We will be discussing in-depth about certain Lwa of the Vodou and some of Haiti's History.
  • The Place of the Mage and Magic in the Modern World: A Panel Discussion
  • Dowsing as a Therapeutic Art for Better Health by Dimitri, a Wiccan High Priest Dowsing in this method is a similar approach to kinesiology, in which the body is its own tool. Dimitri will provide a demonstration using pendulums.
  • Egyptian Magick by Shawn Knight
  • Basic Yoruban Gods, Beliefs, Practices, and their Adaptation to Modernization by Dimitri and Deserie (High Priest and Priestess). Deserie will close with a modern Yoruban-based ritual cleansing and blessing.
  • The Relationship between Quantum Physics and Chaos Magic by Shawn Knight.
  • Sex, Drugs and Rock 'n Roll: Alternative Ways of Achieving Gnosis and their Implications: A Panel Discussion
  • Omnimancy: Intermediate by Arthur Moyer
We have a couple more speakers whose topics are yet to be announced.

If you would like a chance to spend time with a diverse group of magic practitioners and learn/discuss about various paths of magic(k), please drop by! Again, Crucible is on October 6 in Edison, New Jersey. You can check out our site at www.CrucibleConvention.com for more information. Pre-register for discounted tickets as well as a preprinted badge.

Thanks all!
Arthur

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Vagrant Dreamer
post Sep 7 2007, 09:29 AM
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I went to Crucible last year and have to say I was less than impressed. While it might have gotten a little better since then, last year it could have been done out of someone's garage and been every bit as interesting. Shawn Knight did about the only interesting talk, one on Thelema and one on Quantum Uncertainty, and beyond that the attendance was made up of a lot of anti-social individuals, many of whom were clamoring for the attention of the omnimancer group for one reason or another.

Mr. Moyer 'imself did a short introduction on Omnimancy during which he revealed the first 'amp' in their system of tech - and I'm afraid in my estimation the entire discussion greatly damaged my previous opinion of omnimancy and the group, which had appeared to be a rather innovative approach to direct magick.

All in all, you could probably learn more by spending less money to buy a dowload pass from the website here at sacred-magick. While there are likely to be a handful of serious practitioners there for networking, friend-making, etc., you'll have to pick through everyone to find them. God forbid you should go for the attention of one of the Omnimancers, as you're more than likely not worth their time (unless it's the girl with the long brown hair, I forget her name, but she's alright).

As a side note, you know, we get a fair number of authors and 'big' occult names here... you know, maybe we should plan a convention. I'm willing to bet we could pull of a much better one.

peace


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LordArthur
post Sep 7 2007, 10:35 AM
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@Vagrant Dreamer

Honestly, you are the first complaint I've ever gotten about the event (or even past events for that matter). Everyone has always commented how much they really enjoyed the events. The only "complaint" I've gotten until now was there was too much to attend and not enough time (ie. sometimes there would be things scheduled across from each other that the attendee wanted to see both). I'm sorry you didn't have a good time. We can discuss in PM what you feel would add to the event. Admittedly, last year was more thrown together than I would have liked because of the original hotel backing out of their contract "last minute" when it actually hit them we were serious about the subject matter. That meant a more diverse set of speakers was harder to get last minute and advertisement for attendees started far later than normal, not to mention skipping a year of not having the event in the first place which lost it's momentum from previous years. The 2004 event had a far greater attendance by about 3-4 times actually and we are hoping for that or greater this year. Please see the Crucible's past part of the website to see who was speaking then, which included Isaac Bonewits and a few other well known people.

I do think the picture you are painting is rather harsh and not realistic of what happened last year. While I would agree you might learn more from a subscription to a library with hundreds of books than an hour seminar on a subject, I don't think it's a fair comparison. An hour versus the literally hundreds of hours one can spend researching and learning at a library by yourself. So I don't see the relevance. But the difference you get in person is the speakers and other practioners who have "been there", who have real experience in the subject. That is why one goes to this kind of event, to network, even if it is just with the speakers. Or even just to get exposure to things you might not have an opportunity to learn about otherwise.

As far as your issues with the Omnimancers, that seems to be a personal thing and more the crux of your post, and I'd rather take that to PM. I will say since they are the staff, their priorities might be different than you expected running the convention, but I won't know what incident put you in such a bad mood. Hopefully it was simply a misunderstand or different expectations. The Omnimancy lecture itself had more than what you describe, so I don't understand why you felt it had so little.


I still invite everyone to attend. This year we have the most individual and diverse set of speakers of any Crucible to date! Check out the site and see if the speaker set interests you!

Arthur

This post has been edited by LordArthur: Sep 7 2007, 10:53 AM

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Vagrant Dreamer
post Sep 7 2007, 12:56 PM
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It would be fair to say that given the situation surrounding last year's Crucible, it didn't go off as well as it could have.

Since this is out in the open as it is, however, my problem with the speakers was that it was all theory - nothing more personal than what one would read in a book - and not application, experience, etc. Granted, they were lectures, not workshops, none the less to make it worth the money, there should be more than theory, and the listeners should be left with no doubt that the speakers have 'been there'. I'm an excellent study - give me a week with a few books and I can talk about any subject you give me as though I'm a professional. Only a professional will be able to tell that I am not - just as a serious practitioner will be able to tell if the person they're speaking with is experienced or well read. I'm afraid I got the impression the speakers were well read - although I did enjoy the panel discussion, and as I said, some of the lectures. All I'm saying is that it's not enough to introduce material, to justify going.

I went as an observer, for the purpose of seeing what it was about, and went in with the objective point of view of someone simply doing research.

Maybe I will go again this year, and maybe it will go off better. That would be a good thing, there certainly aren't enough occult conventions for my preference.

As to my personal take on Omnimancy and the Omnimancers - it's not that I don't like you people, it's that I've seen no evidence that your magick is any bit as effective as it's reported to be. But heck, I don't care to prove anything to anyone, so I see no reason you or any of the other omnimancers should.

Like I told you privately, however, if I were going to lecture on some subject I was familiar with, like resonance or vibration, I would prove it undeniably, and then talk about what happened. Especially if the subject matter was all together unfamiliar to those present. You tried, and I was unconvinced - therefore, my estimation of omnimancy fell a bit. It's not personal at all - it's just an observation and requisite adjustment of hypothesis. As to the group themselves - I've met a fair number of people who were very serious about their occult path, and the more presence they evince, the greater the strength of resonance I sense in them, uniformly are they more open, talkative, enjoyable people who are more than willing to discuss, clarify, and learn. I've met a much greater number of people who make big claims rather openly, and speak - no offense - with very much the same kind of jovial "lets go open a hole to another dimension" attitude that I observed among the omnis, and frankly, those people typically are not only fairly self-involved, but also not typically very magickally evolved. Observation alone yields a very obvious correlation between character and magickal experience and maturity. Heck, I've watched people grow from one extreme to the other over the course of a decade of going from dreaming and fantasy to real experience and practical growth. Based on my experience and observation, I can only come to one conclusion.

But as I said privately - If you want to prove it, I will sing the praises of omnimancy. As far as crucible goes, that's a gamble like it always will be. Last year, I'm afraid it just didn't meet my rather meager expectations - but perhaps my standards are a bit high; they typically are with most things, I would be a rather unsuccessful mage if they weren't.

peace


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LordArthur
post Sep 7 2007, 05:17 PM
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QUOTE(Vagrant Dreamer @ Sep 7 2007, 02:56 PM) *
It would be fair to say that given the situation surrounding last year's Crucible, it didn't go off as well as it could have.

Since this is out in the open as it is, however, my problem with the speakers was that it was all theory - nothing more personal than what one would read in a book - and not application, experience, etc. Granted, they were lectures, not workshops, none the less to make it worth the money, there should be more than theory, and the listeners should be left with no doubt that the speakers have 'been there'. I'm an excellent study - give me a week with a few books and I can talk about any subject you give me as though I'm a professional. Only a professional will be able to tell that I am not - just as a serious practitioner will be able to tell if the person they're speaking with is experienced or well read. I'm afraid I got the impression the speakers were well read - although I did enjoy the panel discussion, and as I said, some of the lectures. All I'm saying is that it's not enough to introduce material, to justify going.

I went as an observer, for the purpose of seeing what it was about, and went in with the objective point of view of someone simply doing research.

Maybe I will go again this year, and maybe it will go off better. That would be a good thing, there certainly aren't enough occult conventions for my preference.


There is NO DOUBT last year could have gone better. But it was what it was. This year is certainly not last year. Things are far better organized.

Since this is now being conducted openly about such opinions, I would like to quote you from shortly after last year's convention when people were asked on a public form what they thought of Crucible 2006, you volenteered:
(http://www.omnimancy.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=696 )
QUOTE
Crucible was great, although I did mostly hang out in the corner. 'Fraid i'm not terribly social - but the talks were fabulous! sk4p's two lectures on Thelema and QP Theory were awesome, as was Art's presentation on Omnimancy, and the panel discussions on Theurgy vs. Thaumaturgy, and Tradition vs. Ecclectic.

It was good to be around people who work with magick again, the atmosphere is always very different, and more interesting, with sheilds and constructs and probes and things flying through the air.

Even the walk back to NYC was relatively interesting, I managed to learn, through creative deduction, how to warm my body and maintain a localized atmosphere, with a bit of alteration to the material art gave us. That creative energy in gathering like that sticks with you for a little while after.

peace!



I think that speaks for itself. I'm glad you had fun. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Some lectures were more history, some were more 101, not many were advanced per se, but that's the nature of the crowd and the speakers. When the bulk of Crucible's attendees are elders from a bunch of different traditions, then I'm sure the technical nature of many of the lectures will go far higher. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) We can't appease everyone. This year should have a lot more goodies considering the speakers.

Shawn is redoing his Chaos Magick and Quantum Theory lecture because he wasn't happy with the content last year, and is really studying up for this year. His Egyptian Magick talk should be interesting considering how into that he is.
Hector's Vodou lecture was very well received in 2004, but even he says it will be a 101.
Jow's lecture on Arabian Magic should be interesting considering he's been with them for a decade.
Mikki's lecture is still unannounced because while she'd been in her tradition for over a decade, she might have her mentor from Chicago come out and talk with her.
Desiree I know is doing a ritual this year
and lots more going on....

Not everything will catch your fancy, but that's the point of the diversity!

QUOTE
As to my personal take on Omnimancy and the Omnimancers - it's not that I don't like you people, it's that I've seen no evidence that your magick is any bit as effective as it's reported to be. But heck, I don't care to prove anything to anyone, so I see no reason you or any of the other omnimancers should.

Like I told you privately, however, if I were going to lecture on some subject I was familiar with, like resonance or vibration, I would prove it undeniably, and then talk about what happened. Especially if the subject matter was all together unfamiliar to those present. You tried, and I was unconvinced - therefore, my estimation of omnimancy fell a bit. It's not personal at all - it's just an observation and requisite adjustment of hypothesis. As to the group themselves - I've met a fair number of people who were very serious about their occult path, and the more presence they evince, the greater the strength of resonance I sense in them, uniformly are they more open, talkative, enjoyable people who are more than willing to discuss, clarify, and learn. I've met a much greater number of people who make big claims rather openly, and speak - no offense - with very much the same kind of jovial "lets go open a hole to another dimension" attitude that I observed among the omnis, and frankly, those people typically are not only fairly self-involved, but also not typically very magickally evolved. Observation alone yields a very obvious correlation between character and magickal experience and maturity. Heck, I've watched people grow from one extreme to the other over the course of a decade of going from dreaming and fantasy to real experience and practical growth. Based on my experience and observation, I can only come to one conclusion.


One shouldn't judge a book by it's cover. We are jovial about what we do, because I am jovial in how I run the order. Many traditions get too serious about themselves. Considering how secretive we are with what we have, did you really expect a public lecture to have earth shattering information? We are jovial because we can handle ourselves and have been through enough that we can joke around because we are confident in that. A Veteran will tell tales from his war experience jovially like it's a Bourne novel but while he actually lived it, it was hell. I agree the signal to noise ratio in the magical community it rather horrid, so I can understand your position. Unfortunately, in this case, your conclusion is flawed, mostly because you based things on what was presented in a public lecture versus asking for a real demonstration.

Regardless of which, your opinions of Omnimancy should have nothing to do with your opinions of Crucible and it's viability. Your opinions of Omnimancy if you wish to continue to discuss really should be in a separate thread or left in PM.

QUOTE
But as I said privately - If you want to prove it, I will sing the praises of omnimancy. As far as crucible goes, that's a gamble like it always will be. Last year, I'm afraid it just didn't meet my rather meager expectations - but perhaps my standards are a bit high; they typically are with most things, I would be a rather unsuccessful mage if they weren't.

peace


As I've said privately, I've never failed to impress. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) I might hold you to your statement above. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

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Acid09
post Sep 7 2007, 05:29 PM
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Well whenever people mention events like this I get all fruastrated because I live in beautiful sub-urban Colorando and not Jew Jersey. I want to try and attend the metaphysics fair in Denver. But it'd pretty much be just me and really don't like Denver that much.

@ lordarthur are you the guy who organizes this event?


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LordArthur
post Sep 7 2007, 10:48 PM
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QUOTE(Acid09 @ Sep 7 2007, 07:29 PM) *
@ lordarthur are you the guy who organizes this event?


Yep. For better or worse. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

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Vagrant Dreamer
post Sep 8 2007, 12:36 AM
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I had a cabal meeting in Georgia about three weeks after crucible, and it was the first of several I've been to since - while it's not the same kind of atmosphere as a convention, granted, it none the less gave a basis of comparison and well, you know about peak experiences i'm sure.

Right after the convention is when I posted to the omni forum, and to be fair, it wasn't an awful convention, and I never said it was:

QUOTE
I went to Crucible last year and have to say I was less than impressed. While it might have gotten a little better since then, last year it could have been done out of someone's garage and been every bit as interesting. Shawn Knight did about the only interesting talk, one on Thelema and one on Quantum Uncertainty, and beyond that the attendance was made up of a lot of anti-social individuals, many of whom were clamoring for the attention of the omnimancer group for one reason or another.


I'm more than willing to give it a break given the circumstances surrounding, and after all - I hadn't seen the other conventions to compare.

So for all viewing, I officially retract all statements that imply the convention sucked - it didn't, and while it didn't blow my socks off, this year maybe it will. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/giveup.gif)

I certainly look forward to speaking with you, Mr. Moyer - I retain the same interest in your theories that I did before, regardless of my estimation based on my interactions with your group. You'll have to forgive my hardnosed observations - like I said before, I have high standards.

@Acid - Come on, if you can spring for a plane ticket, I'll pay for the room and the convention pass. Whaddya say?

peace


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LordArthur
post Oct 1 2007, 08:56 AM
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Just as a reminder, Crucible is THIS WEEKEND! So mark it on your calendars and I hope to see you there!

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Paradox
post Oct 1 2007, 05:28 PM
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I think I'm like 4 hours from NJ ... but how am I supposed to get there... perhaps if some were to invent some type of automobile then such long travel could be possible O_O


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LordArthur
post Oct 2 2007, 10:42 AM
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QUOTE(Paradox @ Oct 1 2007, 07:28 PM) *
I think I'm like 4 hours from NJ ... but how am I supposed to get there... perhaps if some were to invent some type of automobile then such long travel could be possible O_O


Unfortunately, I'm not really in a position to help. I know there is a pair of people driving up from tennessee, but that's about as close as I know about someone coming from that direction. It isn't like I'm privy to everyone's travel plans. I know some people are flying in, but again, that isn't helping your situation. Perhaps you can find someone willing to take the trip with you!

This post has been edited by LordArthur: Oct 2 2007, 10:43 AM

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Paradox
post Jun 7 2008, 09:22 AM
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Is there a crucible 2008?


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Wiggs1992
post Feb 21 2009, 07:43 PM
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Hmm.. a convention does seem pretty cool, although this topic is more then a year old does the Crucible still occur? I looked at the site, and so far it has not been updated since last years meeting. Perhaps its just too early to be organized? Also, are there other major occult gatherings? websites & information wanted (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sport_boxing.gif)


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